FCI V FIC
Category: Corso Information
Subtitle: #0 By Ian James
Author: jojo
Date: 2007/9/4
An attempt to point out to those new to the world of pedigree dogs the difference between the FCI organisation and the FIC, a commercial dog registry.
Summary: An attempt to point out to those new to the world of pedigree dogs the difference between the FCI organisation and the FIC, a commercial dog registry.
This is prepared in response to the question of the confusion that arises over FCI and FIC.
(in response to confusion that arises over the ... Also - possibly segue into the reason we have to deal with these two - i.e. non-recognition ...ed)
Firstly who are the FCI?, Well I can do no better than direct you to the FCI's own information page.
http://www.fci.be/aboutus.asp?lang=en&sel=7.
Now the FIC, well lets look at their web site,
http://ficregistry.org/aboutfic.html
Both on the face of it look like worthy organisations, but look deeper.
The FIC gives the impression that it runs sanctioned shows, but its own pages give it away.
The FIC sanctions all legitimate shows and matches for Championship points and working titles. Shows which are nationally advertised in dog magazines, newsletters, etc. are automatically sanctioned. (In order to confirm wins with other shows, attach a copy of the show flyer to the Winsheet when it is submitted. If no flyer is available, Contact FIC prior to sending the Winsheet.)
The FIC will grant Championships and Working Titles to dogs that meet all requirements. A Championship certificate will be issued to the owner of the dog, and the owner will have the right to use the title on all registrations and pedigrees. To confirm working titles, send in the original scorecard signed by the Judge postmarked within 10 days of the show. Your scorecard will be copied and returned to you. FIC acknowledges all working titles (obedience, Schutzhund, Ringsport, tracking, agility, therapy dogs, etc.
In other words it automatically sanctions everybody's shows!!!!
Lets look at breed standards.
On the FCI site there is a structured, well organised list of the standards recognised by the FCI, and thereby all FCI member countries.
So we have a system where a breed is recognised firstly in its own country, this recognition is then taken up by the FCI. When it does it becomes recognised by all member country's.
Please find me a FIC breed standard for any breed. There are none.
The wording on the front of its site http://ficregistry.org/mainpage.html includes the phrase "Currently recognizing over four hundred breeds, the FIC acknowledges the very rare as well as the better known breeds. " They also provide a list of breeds they recognise, but not one standard.
Its a parasitic business, run as a business, for money not for dogs.
(I think you jumped a few steps here - maybe a paragraph showing that they charge for registration and thereby make money, summing up with the parasitic business sentence - ed)
Look at the FIC's Winsheet, note that although it looks rather grand, the bottom of the form asks one to sign to say "I (we) do hereby certify that the above information is correct, according to the rules and regulations of the FIC"
Yes, but what rules and regulations? Show me where the FIC trains, sanctions or in anyway provides FIC judging standards.
Apply the same criteria to the FCI, look for the breed of your own intrest. Then look to both sites for information on your chosen breed.
(sentence in the previous paragraph should lead reader - "You will find that information only with the FCI or somesuch? -ed)
The FIC is not the only "register for money group" take a look at this information site for US Dogue owners. These people are similar to us, why would they recognise the FCI but not the FIC?
http://www.ddbs.org/somanyregistries.html
In America the AKC, the main Kennel club, has made strides towards beating the unscrupulous high volume breeders by doing random DNA testing, this as resulted in several registries cropping up.
http://members.tripod.com/~Moosewood/registries.html
Or this bit from another site :
FIC - the Federation of International Canines
The FIC is one of many for-profit all-breed registries in the United States that specialize in rare dog breeds. Owned and operated by the owner of a security company. Dogs can receive an "official FIC Pedigree" without any previous documentation. That is, an owner need only state that his/her dog has parents named so-and-so and the FIC will issue the dog a pedigree proclaiming that it is a pure breed.
(credit this site? - ed)
Or This from the Doberman Club of America:
The puppymill industry has set up several registries to combat the challenges the AKC placed before them by instituting the frequently used sires program. Included are these undesirable registries:
FIC (federation of international canines)
CKC (continental kennel club)
These acronyms are remarkably similar to the legitimate registries, FCI (Federation Cynologique Internationale) and CKC (Canadian Kennel Club). It is possible that imported puppies will be touted to be registered with the FIC. PLEASE pass word along to the public to beware of these puppymill registries.
This warning is also issued on the Bernese Mountain Dog site and a few others.
Each person must make their own judgement on what they find acceptable. To me, the SACC/ENCI/FCI standard is the only acceptable one, and registration bodies acceptable to the FCI the only ones acceptable to me. There is a relationship between the FCI and the KC, as they tentatively acknowledge on there site.
"
" FAQ
For the following questions, the FCI requests the visitors (PRIVATE PEOPLE) to turn to the national kennel club (FCI members) of their country (list and details available by clicking on « member countries »)
· Issuance of titles of International Champion (Beauty or Work).
· List of breeders of any FCI-recognised breed.
· Issuance of a pedigree or information about a pedigree already issued.
We also inform our visitors that any information about dogs exported to the USA, England or Canada are available from the national organisations of these countries, i.e the American Kennel Club, the Kennel Club and the Canadian Kennel Club."
(although a direct quote - I think this needs a little expounding as it's tenuous... - ed)
In the interest of our breed do not accept a pedigree that does not contain only FCI recognised registrations until we get breed recognition. this includes second/third generation UK dogs Both parents for now should be FCI. It is very unlikely that the KC will recognise any kennel club that is not an FCI member . As at today 28th October 2004.
(the aforementiioned swap FCI/FIC, and also I think this needs rewording as it's a little confusing... -ed)
This is prepared in response to the question of the confusion that arises over FCI and FIC.
(in response to confusion that arises over the ... Also - possibly segue into the reason we have to deal with these two - i.e. non-recognition ...ed)
Firstly who are the FCI?, Well I can do no better than direct you to the FCI's own information page.
http://www.fci.be/aboutus.asp?lang=en&sel=7.
Now the FIC, well lets look at their web site,
http://ficregistry.org/aboutfic.html
Both on the face of it look like worthy organisations, but look deeper.
The FIC gives the impression that it runs sanctioned shows, but its own pages give it away.
The FIC sanctions all legitimate shows and matches for Championship points and working titles. Shows which are nationally advertised in dog magazines, newsletters, etc. are automatically sanctioned. (In order to confirm wins with other shows, attach a copy of the show flyer to the Winsheet when it is submitted. If no flyer is available, Contact FIC prior to sending the Winsheet.)
The FIC will grant Championships and Working Titles to dogs that meet all requirements. A Championship certificate will be issued to the owner of the dog, and the owner will have the right to use the title on all registrations and pedigrees. To confirm working titles, send in the original scorecard signed by the Judge postmarked within 10 days of the show. Your scorecard will be copied and returned to you. FIC acknowledges all working titles (obedience, Schutzhund, Ringsport, tracking, agility, therapy dogs, etc.
In other words it automatically sanctions everybody's shows!!!!
Lets look at breed standards.
On the FCI site there is a structured, well organised list of the standards recognised by the FCI, and thereby all FCI member countries.
So we have a system where a breed is recognised firstly in its own country, this recognition is then taken up by the FCI. When it does it becomes recognised by all member country's.
Please find me a FIC breed standard for any breed. There are none.
The wording on the front of its site http://ficregistry.org/mainpage.html includes the phrase "Currently recognizing over four hundred breeds, the FIC acknowledges the very rare as well as the better known breeds. " They also provide a list of breeds they recognise, but not one standard.
Its a parasitic business, run as a business, for money not for dogs.
(I think you jumped a few steps here - maybe a paragraph showing that they charge for registration and thereby make money, summing up with the parasitic business sentence - ed)
Look at the FIC's Winsheet, note that although it looks rather grand, the bottom of the form asks one to sign to say "I (we) do hereby certify that the above information is correct, according to the rules and regulations of the FIC"
Yes, but what rules and regulations? Show me where the FIC trains, sanctions or in anyway provides FIC judging standards.
Apply the same criteria to the FCI, look for the breed of your own intrest. Then look to both sites for information on your chosen breed.
(sentence in the previous paragraph should lead reader - "You will find that information only with the FCI or somesuch? -ed)
The FIC is not the only "register for money group" take a look at this information site for US Dogue owners. These people are similar to us, why would they recognise the FCI but not the FIC?
http://www.ddbs.org/somanyregistries.html
In America the AKC, the main Kennel club, has made strides towards beating the unscrupulous high volume breeders by doing random DNA testing, this as resulted in several registries cropping up.
http://members.tripod.com/~Moosewood/registries.html
Or this bit from another site :
FIC - the Federation of International Canines
The FIC is one of many for-profit all-breed registries in the United States that specialize in rare dog breeds. Owned and operated by the owner of a security company. Dogs can receive an "official FIC Pedigree" without any previous documentation. That is, an owner need only state that his/her dog has parents named so-and-so and the FIC will issue the dog a pedigree proclaiming that it is a pure breed.
(credit this site? - ed)
Or This from the Doberman Club of America:
The puppymill industry has set up several registries to combat the challenges the AKC placed before them by instituting the frequently used sires program. Included are these undesirable registries:
FIC (federation of international canines)
CKC (continental kennel club)
These acronyms are remarkably similar to the legitimate registries, FCI (Federation Cynologique Internationale) and CKC (Canadian Kennel Club). It is possible that imported puppies will be touted to be registered with the FIC. PLEASE pass word along to the public to beware of these puppymill registries.
This warning is also issued on the Bernese Mountain Dog site and a few others.
Each person must make their own judgement on what they find acceptable. To me, the SACC/ENCI/FCI standard is the only acceptable one, and registration bodies acceptable to the FCI the only ones acceptable to me. There is a relationship between the FCI and the KC, as they tentatively acknowledge on there site.
"
" FAQ
For the following questions, the FCI requests the visitors (PRIVATE PEOPLE) to turn to the national kennel club (FCI members) of their country (list and details available by clicking on « member countries »)
· Issuance of titles of International Champion (Beauty or Work).
· List of breeders of any FCI-recognised breed.
· Issuance of a pedigree or information about a pedigree already issued.
We also inform our visitors that any information about dogs exported to the USA, England or Canada are available from the national organisations of these countries, i.e the American Kennel Club, the Kennel Club and the Canadian Kennel Club."
(although a direct quote - I think this needs a little expounding as it's tenuous... - ed)
In the interest of our breed do not accept a pedigree that does not contain only FCI recognised registrations until we get breed recognition. this includes second/third generation UK dogs Both parents for now should be FCI. It is very unlikely that the KC will recognise any kennel club that is not an FCI member . As at today 28th October 2004.
(the aforementiioned swap FCI/FIC, and also I think this needs rewording as it's a little confusing... -ed)
Corso Articles V1
URL: http://www.thefocc.com/xoops/modules/article/view.article.php/c6/13